Migration Solution Needed
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As reported previously, I’m not comfortable continuing to build my WordPress blog, here or elsewhere, until I can convince myself that I know how to move my WP site from host to host as needed. This post will outline the problem, and suggest a constructive solution.
THE PROBLEM
From earlier conversations I know that your advice is to use the export/import features built in to WordPress. I’ve now done that about 100 times (literally) in a couple dozen fresh WP installations on two different hosts, and the migration has not worked a single time. Not a single time.
What this means that even if export/import did appear to work, I would have to manually check all the links and images on about 200 pages to ensure migration success. This is not a scalable solution as I continue to grow my site.
Thinking I must be doing something wrong I’ve researched the issue via Google and found numerous other people having similar problems. For example, just yesterday I found an article explaining the import/export feature in clear detailed terms, and everyone in the comment section said it didn’t work for them.
Beyond Anecdotal Evidence
And then there is the most convincing evidence that the migration tools built in to WordPress are, to put it politely, inadequate.
Go to WordPress.org and search for migration plugins. For example, here’s one I’ve been testing: https://wordpress.org/plugins/all-in-one-wp-migration/
Please note that this plugin has over 2 million active installations. And now ask yourself this. If the migration tools built in to WordPress are so simple and easy and automated etc, why are literally millions of people installing this migration plugin? Why are at least some of them paying the $70 fee for the pro version of that plugin? And of course this is just one of a number of migration plugins available.
Point being, I am now convinced beyond any doubt that I can’t count on the import/export features built in to WordPress, and so need to find another migration method that I can have confidence in if I am to continue publishing in WordPress.
A SOLUTION?
The plugin I’ve linked to above shows promise. The find and replace feature of that plugin has been unreliable in my testing, but I have been able to easily migrate small test sites from one host to another numerous times.
So here’s my constructive proposal.
Rent me a Business account for $25 for one month. I will then be able to install plugins in my account and test migration of my entire site by that method. If that works, I will be happy and stop posting about this issue. If it doesn’t work, I will accept that I made a mistake choosing WordPress as my CMS, live and learn, and move on. In either case, my writing on this issue will end, which would seem to be in your interest as much as it is in mine.
Yes, you will likely lose me as a customer, given that I don’t agree with the TOS for WordPress.com. But as you can see from this post and others, getting rid of me is not such a bad plan, given that I am a typoholic capable of ripping some parts of your sales pitch to shreds.
As it stands, I can’t continue building my site here, nor can I move my site elsewhere. I can’t even give my site away as that would just transfer this problem to those whom I respect. It seems in everyone’s interest to resolve this one way or another at the earliest date.
I launched my site to fight nuclear weapons, not to become a WordPress expert, or a WordPress.com critic. I hope we can agree it would be wise to get me off the WordPress subject and back on the nuclear weapons subject.
Thanks for listening.
The blog I need help with is: (visible only to logged in users)
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Greetings WPgods,
Quick background, I’ve concluded that I don’t want to invest any more time in to WordPress sites until I know how to move a WP site from one host to another. 25 years of building sites has made me wary of depending on any host, as something always happens sooner or later.
So I’ve been experimenting with moving WP test sites on some regular Cpanel hosting accounts. I seem to be stuck on moving the WP database and could use some help.
Let’s assume I’ve done a fresh install of WP on a new host, and moved all the uploads and plugins from old host to new host via FTP.
I know how to create a new database with mySQL databases. I know how to import a database via phpMyAdmin. I know how to edit the wp-config file.
But none of that is working. There’s obviously something I don’t know, but I can’t figure out what it is.
Thanks for any advice!
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Hi there @nukeban hope you’re keeping well.
I’m not entirely sure I follow, but it sounds like you are moving WP to WP rather than WPcom to WP since only the WPcom Business or eCommerce plans have database access. See here> https://wordpress.com/support/phpmyadmin-and-mysql/#database-access
If you need help with moving WP to WP, the best place to ask would be the ORG support forums at https://wordpress.org/support/forums
Otherwise, if you are moving a free, Personal or Premium WPcom site to WP > https://wordpress.com/support/export/
opinion/
I’ve had sites hosted with various web hosting providers over the past 21 years, including self-hosted WP sites and other free web hosting sites, and the only one that’s been around for the long haul has been WPcom. Of course that is absolutely no guarantee of anything, other than just my 2¢.
/opinion -
Hi Jennifer, thanks for your reply.
Yes, I understand that my Premium account doesn’t have database access, which is fine as I’m not trying to do anything with that right now. I’m just trying learn how to move WP sites in general. I don’t feel comfortable continuing to build any WP site on any host until I know how to do that.
I don’t have any particular concerns about WP.com, I’m just reacting to the hosting industry in general. You seem to have had much the same experience. Typically what happens is that the good hosts get bought up by some big dog who then proceeds to trash the service. Servint, A Small Orange, many others. In fact, I myself sold an email hosting service in 2000 to a big dog, who paid mid 6 figures for my company and then proceeded to demolish it through incompetence. It only took 6 months for them to sink the ship. Anyway…
You’re right, in theory, WordPress.org would be the place to ask this question. I did try that already, and let’s just say it didn’t work out. Everybody wants to link me to somewhere else, nobody wishes to engage the question directly. The mods on WP.org have a quite different mindset than your team, I won’t be spending much time there.
Honestly, I’ve been working on this database business for awhile now, here and elsewhere, and unless I learn how to move a WP site soon I’m going to bail on WP as a blogging platform and go back to what I was using previously. It’s not clear to me what the big benefit of mySQL is, as in 25 years I never needed it before, and everything was fine.
So, all that out of the way, I’m hoping to learn how to move a WP database from one host to a WP installation on another host. I’ll keep working on it, until I finally run out patience.
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Otherwise, if you are moving a free, Personal or Premium WPcom site to WP > https://wordpress.com/support/export/
BTW, this doesn’t work. Exporting the XML file works fine, but importing it in to another WP installation doesn’t. We had a long thread on this already, so I won’t repeat all that again.
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Hi @nukeban,
you won’t be able to move the database from WordPress.com. You can only move your content. We have a full guide on moving WordPress.com site to another host, have a look here:
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Hello again,
I did try that already, and let’s just say it didn’t work out.
Be that as it may, as helpful as we are here, the focus of these forums is on the WPcom platform and its users. If your future endeavors are on using WP, engaging with the WP community is your best bet.
I’m hoping to learn how to move a WP database from one host to a WP installation on another host.
Did you search the WP documentation? This might help: https://wordpress.org/support/article/moving-wordpress/
If you have more questions about this process> https://wordpress.org/support/forums
Best wishes
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you won’t be able to move the database from WordPress.com.
Yes, I know that already, as explained top of thread.
You can only move your content.
Yes, I can download the XML file. Very easy. I can download the images, also very easy. This is great for backing up a WP.com site to my computer. So far so good, thumbs up approval, rated perfect by this user.
But I can’t actually “move my content” anywhere at all until I learn how to search and replace within a mySQL database, because WP.com has put my images in it’s domain, without my permission. That seems a reasonable enough procedure for free users, but not for paying customers.
I’m not hysterical about any of this. I’m actually trying to help you guys, because you always make a good faith effort to help me. In that spirit, here’s proof that I’m on to something worth considering.
If the WordPress interface for moving sites was adequate, there would be no market for plug-ins like Duplicator. Duplicator and similar plug-ins exist because some significant portion of the market has concluded that the WordPress interface for transferring sites does not meet their needs.
One solution to this issue of moving sites could be to continue to tell users that they need to do this, do that, go here, go there, learn this, learn that, read this, read that etc.
Another solution could be to upgrade WordPress technology so that transferring a site is as easy as downloading the XML file and images. That part of the interface is perfect, and can serve as a model for transfer improvements.
And/or, perhaps you could write some docs explaining the benefits of using mySQL as a storage medium? I’m sure there must be some benefits given that it seems the entire web is now using that technology. I just don’t know what those benefits are myself, and so assume that many others don’t as well. And so, not knowing the benefits, I tend to resent the requirements of using mySQL.
Ok, I did all this already in the other thread so I’ll let such editorializing go unless you wish to discuss it further. Thanks for listening.
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Be that as it may, as helpful as we are here, the focus of these forums is on the WPcom platform and its users. If your future endeavors are on using WP, engaging with the WP community is your best bet.
Ok, fair enough, I agree you are not obligated to address these questions as they are not really related to my Premium account. I get it, no problem. I’ve asked the question here only because I’ve run out of other places to ask it.
However, I will not be engaging much further with the WP.org community, as I’ve already done that and learned a key mission of that site is to provide the mods there with people they can lecture.
Like I said, I already asked this very question there in a very polite and specific manner, and they immediately ignored the question and dove right in to lecturing me. A consistent pattern. I wouldn’t have minded at all if they had simply ignored the question, but then they couldn’t lecture me, so ignoring is out.
Obviously, none of this is the fault of WP.com in any way at all. Just warning you, you put the reputation of WP.com in some danger every time you refer people to WP.org. The mods and staff here are very professional. Not the case on WP.org.
Ok, I’ll learn this by myself, or I won’t. If I don’t learn it soon, I’ll be moving my site to another CMS and solve the problem that way. I’m not going to invest endless hours in any site I don’t have full control of. If this seems extreme, ok, but please recall, you’re a good host, and you’ve grabbed my images without my permission. I need to be in a position to deal with such things when they exceed my tolerance for host company shenanigans.
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Aha! I think I FINALLY figured out migrating WP sites. I’m making this report as a way to suggest how you might have answered my questions about migration from the beginning. Perhaps this will come in handy in serving some future customer?
1) First, there is no easy automated manner of migrating a WP.com Premium (or lower) account. So it would probably be wise to stop saying this. It’s possible to migrate such accounts, but definitely not simple, easy and automated.
2) However, there IS a simple, easy, automated manner of migrating a WP.com Business or higher account, or any WP account anywhere that can use plugins.
All-in-One WP Migration
I found and tested this plugin yesterday, and best I can tell so far, it is a masterpiece of simplicity and reliability.
There are very helpful instruction videos at the bottom of the above page. After watching one video one time I was able to easily migrate a test site on the first try, no hassles, no problems, no headaches.
So, in summary, WP.com staff (and WP.org volunteers) could have resolved my concerns and questions about migration with a single sentence, thus sparing yourselves multiple threads from this, um, prolific poster.
I get that it’s not exactly in your interest to teach your customers how to migrate, but there surely will be more users such as myself who won’t feel comfortable investing thousands of hours in a WP site that they don’t know how to move if needed. Perhaps migration questions could be taken private?
And as a reminder, it seems it would be wise to ask permission from your paying customers before putting their images in your domain. I get that a case can be made for why that is a good idea, but the case should be made and permission requested, instead of just grabbing the images without discussion. It was the discovery that my images weren’t in my domain that started me wondering how I would move my site if I wished to do so.
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Hi there,
Thank you for the well-explained feedback. We definitely appreciate it.
And as a reminder, it seems it would be wise to ask permission from your paying customers before putting their images in your domain.
I’m not sure I am understanding the context here. Are you referring to images on our server due to your uploading images to your WordPress.com site? Or are you referring to a screenshot of your content or something we shared with you in another thread?
Just trying to get clarification there.
Thanks, -
Are you referring to images on our server due to your uploading images to your WordPress.com site?
Yes, that’s it. Or more precisely, my images being stored in WP.com’s domain.
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Okay, I just wanted to make sure I knew what you were referring to.
Per our Terms of Service:
License. By submitting Content to Automattic for inclusion on your website, you grant Automattic a world-wide, royalty-free, and non-exclusive license to reproduce, modify, adapt, and publish the Content solely for the purpose of displaying, distributing, and promoting your website. This license also allows Automattic to make any publicly-posted Content available to third parties selected by Automattic (through Firehose, for example) so that these third parties can analyze and distribute (but not publicly display) the Content through their services. You also give other WordPress.com users permission to share your Content on other WordPress.com websites and add their own Content to it (aka to “reblog” your Content), so long as they use only a portion of your post and they give you credit as the original author by linking back to your website (the reblogging function on WordPress.com does this automatically!).
However, at the same time:
Removing Content. If you delete Content, we will use reasonable efforts to remove it from public view (or in the case of a private website, from view by the authorized visitors) on WordPress.com, but you acknowledge that caching or references to the Content may not be made immediately unavailable.
So, if you do not want us to host your images any longer, you can delete them, make your site private, or delete the site altogether, but it may take some time for cache images to be purged from the server.
In regards to your content still showing up on search engines after taken down, it’s up to Google to decide when and how to include/remove this page from search results, WordPress.com doesn’t have any control over that. For more information you can read our FAQ about search engines here:
http://en.support.wordpress.com/search-engines/You can try requesting removal from Google by following the instructions here:
http://www.google.com/support/webmasters/bin/answer.py?hl=en&answer=92865Google also provides information and tools for webmasters, you might find further information on their tools here:
http://en.support.wordpress.com/webmaster-tools/
Let me know if you have any questions.
Thanks!
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By submitting Content to Automattic for inclusion on your website, you grant Automattic a world-wide, royalty-free, and non-exclusive license to reproduce, modify, adapt, and publish the Content solely for the purpose of displaying, distributing, and promoting your website.
Does this apply to paying customers, or just free users?
Okay, I just wanted to make sure I knew what you were referring to.
Well, to make a long story mercifully short, what I’m really referring to is the mindset behind all of the above, with putting paying client’s images in the WP.com domain without asking being just an example.
I’m not freaked out about that, but it’s a reminder that where ever I might host a WordPress site, I need to know how to move it as needed. You know how it is, it takes a zillion hours to create a decent site, a big investment which needs to be protected.
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…with putting paying client’s images in the WP.com domain without asking being just an example.
Why is this a problem? If a person wishes to move their site they face the job of changing all the image URLs across the entire site.
The WordPress importer doesn’t work for this.
I just tested 3 different search and replace plugins on my test server. One replaced some URLs while ignoring others. The other 2 plugins didn’t work at all.
If I wish to proceed I now need to file reports with 3 plugin authors who will want me to help them diagnose the problem, a process which will take far more time than a simple search and replace, and may not accomplish anything.
3 plugins failed to work, so that could mean a problem with my test server. Like what? I have no idea. How do I even pose the question to the host? My host will probably send me to the plugin author, who may in turn suggest I contact my host.
This could easily turn in to hours of work for a simple search and replace. Who knows how long it will take to reach success.
And none of this work would be necessary if WP.com had put my images in my domain, like every other host I’ve used in 25 years.
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Does this apply to paying customers, or just free users?
It applies to all users that decide to create a site on WordPress.com, it’s part of our Terms and Conditions.
Again, thank you for your feedback. We can’t help with the issues you’re having with third-party plugins, I would suggest posting to the community forums at https://wordpress.org/support/forums/. Many users migrate their sites from WordPress.com to different hosts and do not have these issues so there may be something on your new site that causes the problem.
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It applies to all users that decide to create a site on WordPress.com, it’s part of our Terms and Conditions.
Thank you for the clarification. Strange policy for paying customers, but ok, now I know. Agree I should have read the TOS.
As example of a strange policy, imagine this. Suppose my policy for becoming a WP.com customer had been that I obtain joint ownership of all WP.com content to do with as I please? If you’d received that email wouldn’t you have laughed and then hit the delete button?
The policy you’re citing seems appropriate for free users because WP.com is providing a service in exchange for nothing, and thus has no obligation to the free user. If I was a free user I wouldn’t have raised this issue. Respectfully, I think the WP.com management team has confused it’s relationship with free users with it’s relationship with paying customers.
If that seems wrong, ok, I’m listening. Can you list any of your competitors who claim joint ownership of their customer’s content? Does every host make such a claim and for 25 years I’ve not been reading their TOS carefully enough (as I failed to do with WP.com)? If this is the case, ok, I’m ready to be further educated.
In my particular case it’s not such a big deal as my blog isn’t a business and I’d be happy to have you spread the word on an important subject. It’s the principle which is bugging me, the fact that WP.com is grabbing their client’s content without permission and apparently sees nothing wrong with that. I like you guys, I really do, but must admit things like this raise a question in my mind about what else strange is going on behind the scenes that I haven’t yet learned about.
We can’t help with the issues you’re having with third-party plugins
Actually, yes, you can.
1) You could put my images in to my domain where they belong.
2) You could stop sending me to other people to solve problems which WP.com caused.
3) You could abandon all claims to my content so that I could again trust WP.com, and thus wouldn’t have a need to learn how to migrate WP sites.
I realize that you personally may not have the power to do any of this, and I accept that, and mean no personal offense. But if you can’t solve the problem then I have to.
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Hi @nukeban, I know just what you mean re: big companies buying up small hosting companies and wrecking them. I’ve got a few old sites I hadn’t moved here that got messed up that way, well within 6 months, too. Usually that’s big hosts gobbling up smaller hosts, though; we’re actually a pretty big host here already and have been for a while, if it’s of any comfort.
I can’t really go argue with Systems on why we store our images on a CDN with files.wordpress.com address; it’s just the way our infrastructure is set up. When you stop using our service and delete a site, it removes the files at those addresses, too.
The regular WordPress import plugin _should_ automatically change the media addresses on import though. I’ve migrated many sites using these steps:
https://move.wordpress.comIn dozens if not hundreds of migrations, I only remember seeing an issue like that once or twice. What I did see a lot of is the new host server timing out on import, in which case re-running the import usually takes care of it. If not, I’ve used a WXR splitter to make smaller chunks and import those. Once or twice I had to clear and start over.
I can’t say how well that would work though if you were to plop all the media in place from the tar and then run the importer. So are you using these steps to migrate the site, or are you using another process?
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Hi there, thanks for your reply.
To avoid further repeating myself, which admittedly gets tiresome, here’s a new angle to explore perhaps.
A lot of the WordPress problems being reported (by many other people besides myself) seem to have their root in the choice of mySQL as the content storage medium for WordPress. Here’s an example to illustrate.
I’ve coded my own CMS (dynamic and static) from scratch. It stored data in text files. When I wanted to do a find and replace I would download the files via FTP, run a multi-file find and replace with a text editor, and then upload the files back to server. Super easy process taking about a minute. Worked perfectly every time, for years.
If there was some issue with anything, I could always open any of the text files and easily examine the data stored there.
In WordPress it’s taking me days of experimenting with various plugins to try to accomplish a find and replace, which I have yet to do.
What are the benefits of using mySQL as a storage medium? I’m sure there must be some given the widespread use of mySQL across the web. I have this vague notion that mySQL is a more powerful storage medium which makes it more appropriate than text files for high traffic sites. If true, ok, fair enough. But how many bloggers have a high traffic site? 5 per cent?
Point being, I stored data in text files for years on low traffic sites and never experienced any kind of problem as a result, which makes me wonder why I’m now wrestling with the demands of mySQL.
A related issue may be the plug-in concept. Open source is great in very many ways, but it also means anybody and everybody can write plugins for WordPress, and not all of them will know what they’re doing. The built in importer in WordPress DOES NOT WORK (no matter how many times you guys tell me it does) so I am forced in to the plugin marketplace to find a solution. Some of the plugins I love, some seem to be crap, and so I have to sort through the pile to separate the wheat from the chaff. AND, my WordPress specific host WP.com can not help me with plugins as you didn’t write them, and so I am repeatedly sent elsewhere on any plugin related issue.
So, I’m starting to question the basic design of WordPress, an issue that obviously neither of us can do anything about.
At first I was just wondering how I would move a WordPress site if I needed to. Now I’m wondering, how would I get all my content in to another CMS if wanted to.
On top of all that, blogging is dead. Well, ok, ok, so my blog is mostly dead at least. :-) So even before technical and TOS problems I’m investing a lot of time in serving very few people. This is nobody’s fault but my own, but, you know, just another reason to question what I’m doing here.
I think maybe I’ll use this forum as my blog from here out. It’s free, and hey, I have readers here!! :-)
Thanks for listening, and have a great night!
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Hello again!
Please note that this plugin has over 2 million active installations. And now ask yourself this. If the migration tools built in to WordPress are so simple and easy and automated etc, why are literally millions of people installing this migration plugin?
You are now talking about WordPress.org users who will install this plugin to easily move their sites with plugins and custom themes between hosts.
This has nothing to do with WordPress.com and how things work here.Rent me a Business account for $25 for one month. I will then be able to install plugins in my account and test migration of my entire site by that method. If that works, I will be happy and stop posting about this issue.
You can upgrade to Business plan and, if you’re not happy, within 30 days you can reach out via live chat so and we will be happy to downgrade you back to Premium and refund the difference you paid.
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