Removing the scrollbar from the post editor one of the worst "improvements" yet
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> I saw also constructive posts here.
definitely. but there were also people who called the development team stupid, brain-damaged incompetents. recall the old saying “it only takes one bad apple to spoil the <insert noun of choice here>.” this thread has had more than one — quite enough to tarnish everything constructive that may have been said.
i don’t think the editor changes are good but i don’t actually _use_ the editor to edit text so i’m not _that_ upset. more worrisome to me is what wordpress management considers appropriate communication. to that end, anything that might make them less likely to communicate (like name-calling) disturbs me.
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Many of us who miss the scrollbar — and would like it returned — have commented with patience, politeness, and particulars. Would that WP would respond in kind. All together now: Bring back our scrollbar today.
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Hi there!
As an update, the issues you’ve reported regarding pasting in the Visual Editor and the Proofread button are being addressed by our developers. Let me apologize for the delays and inconvenience this has caused. I really appreciate your patience and rest assured that your discussions and contributions won’t go unnoticed. Thank you!
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@rose I agree with most of your points but professionals should get around with this. They could appeal to honor, if not enough then they could warn, delete posts and what not. I know lots of companies who stay calm, who aren´t afraid to handle those situations. Other than that, I do agree with you. But I also do understand some who were upset because there was neither communication before the changes and not much after the changes. No ignore everyone, that is a shame to be honest because I posted a screenshot with bug reports.. others too. I feel sad about this.
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So, apparently they made the change to fix a problem that I did not have:
At least I never had the issue they describe. Whenever I edited my long posts, I could scroll within the text area, and the tool bars (all of them; side, top, bottom) stayed where they were, happy as clams.
Does anyone know what problem they ‘fixed’?
Unless they are referring to other platforms (smart phones and smart tablets).
Anyway, I am done with this topic. It’s evident they are not going to change it back, just as it’s evident they are not reading this . . . oh, wait . . . druesome just answered.
He looks like a nice guy; I feel sorry for him having drawn the short straw.
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Thanks for your update, Drew. Good to know we’re not just trees falling in the middle of the forest with no one around to hear us hit the ground. I do so miss my scrollbar and look forward to being happily reunited ;-)
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WordPress should have a good look at how Linden Research (aka Linden Lab) structures its beta and release candidate cycles, with people opting in to try beta versions of the software, etc. Just sayin’.
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Just saying …
I cannot isolate anything that would motivate our developers from changing from the continuous rollout of new code situation at WordPress.com, and use use of the WordPress.com as a guinea pig platform for testing of all WordPress version upgrades for a month before the new versions are released to WordPress.org users.See here https://en.forums.wordpress.com/topic/editor-suggestions?replies=2#post-1969160
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Fewer complaints from dismayed users perhaps? Voluntary, high-quality and detailed feedback? These two advantages sound pretty tempting to me.
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Fewer complaints from dismayed users perhaps? Voluntary, high-quality and detailed feedback? These two advantages sound pretty tempting to me.
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@ disperser,and others
From http://en.blog.wordpress.com/2014/07/29/wordpress-update
One small — but extremely helpful and time-saving — update we’ve introduced is a fixed toolbar to the Post Editor. Before, if you were writing a longer post and wanted to use any of the formatting tools, you’d have to scroll up the page to make the toolbar appear again. No more.
The pinning of the post editor toolbar was acknowledged early in this thread, on page 2, by
- musicdoc1, Jul 22, 2014, 10:18 PM: “The post editor toolbar was fixed in place. That was a good change. However when the toolbar was fixed in place, they removed — intentionally or not remains to be seen — the editor window scrollbar and resizer”
- roseglace, Jul 23, 2014, 11:44 AM: “the sticky toolbar is probably an improvement, although there arguably should be a setting to allow the ‘old’ behavior…on the other hand — the scrollbar issue. i don’t want a text input area ‘that big.'”
- thenakedlistener, Jul 23, 2014, 12:10 PM: (first item in his PROS list) “(a) Fixed toolbar (where the formatting buttons are) – easier formatting.”
WordPress claims that the pinning or fixing of the toolbar in place results in decreased scrolling time, especially in longer posts. Interestingly, this claimed result was not stated as a goal two months ago in a description of the proposed changes, in a WordPress.org thread, under the title “Focus on editing, while editing” (Thanks, to monaeberhardt, for that link.):
Ideas:
- Let the editor take up the full height of the content. Scroll it with the page. Only one scroll.
- Pin the header/footer editing toolbars to top/bottom when they would otherwise be scrolled out of view.
- Fade out toolbar, menu, and other meta boxes
While recognizing that the pinning of the toolbar is or might be a time-saving improvement, members thenakelistener, roseglace, and I all noted net detrimental results of the July 22 changes. Pinning the toolbar did not require removal of the editor window scrollbar. WP: You save us time spent scrolling with one change, and simultaneously add time spent scrolling with another change. Where’s the net gain?
Contrary to what WordPress claims, countless users have (in this thread and elsewhere) described increased scrolling time caused by one or more of the July 22 changes. Increased scrolling time to use the “save” and “update” buttons, to paste tags copied from text in the post window, and to access the other options in the sidebar Publishing box. Would we be complaining about the lost time caused by toolbar removal if we had noticed that the pinning of the window toolbar had saved us even more time than is lost? Probably not, or at least not as loudly and persistently. The net effect for most users, at least of those represented in this thread, appears to be a detrimental one. A net of more time spent scrolling and a worsened user experience.
The above doesn’t even address the numerous other new issues that came as specially packed surprises with the 22 July mods. A quick mention of some of those described in this thread:
1. removal of the post editor resizing tool
2. stripping of text (and links) pasted into visual editor
3. two separate proofreader issues involving migrating window toolbar, blocked text, toggle switch failure, and more problems
4. white space of varying size above text in editor window (fixed)
5. gallery editor button failure (fixed)
6. new image editing issues
7. default resetting of media gallery to grid view could lead to PC crash due combination of infinite scroll and excessive volume of images
8. poll button failure -
@monaeberhardt
Fewer complaints maybe but consider that there are millions who blog here and whose blogs have been impacted by these changes. Granted we bloggers aren’t aware of how many of those blogs have been abandoned and how many are active, not how frequently the latter are updated but we know the vast and overwhelming majority of users never post to the support forums. As best as I can recall without searching I’ve believe I have seen only one thread that had over 1200 unique users post into it over the course of these last 8 years. Usually what happens is the same small number of users who are unhappy post again and again and again as we see depicted here.re: high quality detailed feedback
Any constructive criticism is noted by Support Staff and is communicated to the developers, who are also able to read these threads. That said I believe the impetus for almost if not all changes made to the core and reflected in WordPress version updates are coming from those who use the free WordPress.ORG software to make their living from. -
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@musicdoc1
I am running Windows and using Firefox 31, Chrome 36 and occasionally IE 11. Are you running Windows XP which is not longer supported software? I’m asking because I don’t seem to have as many issues as you do. -
@ timethief,
Yes, I’ve got Windows XP and FF 31.0. But the issues listed aren’t all affecting me.I was able to reproduce some of the issues reported in this thread by others (the first of the two proofread issues described, as noted earlier a couple of times), but not all of them (jumping cursor, the second proofread issue, poll button failure).
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I meant to note that those who typically create long posts seem to be the most upset by the changes, the most adversely affected by the removal of the post editor scrollbar, and the resizer. Such users have almost unanimously in this thread reported increased scrolling time since the mod, exactly the opposite of the result claimed by WP:
One small — but extremely helpful and time-saving — update we’ve introduced is a fixed toolbar to the Post Editor. Before, if you were writing a longer post and wanted to use any of the formatting tools, you’d have to scroll up the page to make the toolbar appear again. No more.
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Timethief just remember most users will not complain its kinda like 20 employees all agree to go tell the boss that they want something and when you get to his office you are the only there
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The two sides in the argument report opposite results for different reasons. One side is focused on the effects of one change (toolbar pinned), and the other is focused on the effects other changes (scrollbar and resizer removal).
Until both sides consider the combined effects of all of the relevant changes it will remain difficult to even reach agreement on what the principal issues are, before addressing the task of finding solutions.
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I usually make long posts. The thing I don’t like about the new change is that because I now have only one scroll bar, I soon lose access to the “save” and “preview” buttons. To see the effect of something I’ve edited, and save it, I have scroll to the top to access those buttons, thus losing my place in the text. It seems to be an unnecessary inconvenience. As with all changes around here, I’m getting used to it, but it does seem to be something that can be fixed by moving those two buttons into the pinned area.
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